Discussion List for campus-based and allied personnel working to end gender-based violence on campus.

[Lauren Klein <>]

Like others have mentioned, I'm not going to label this person's experience for her.  

I think the question for peer education is, what do we want sexual culture to be like? For most people, sex is primarily pleasure.  The fact that this is clearly not pleasurable or mutual is a problem. There is a lot of oppression inherent in the "it's easier to just do it and get it over with than talk about it" thing and not wanting to disappoint someone or feel like you "led them on." There are both individual implications (what would he have done if she objected? What was he thinking while this was happening?) and collective (Why does she and so many other women feel like laying there staring at the ceiling should be expected of them?) 

This really illuminates that we can't elucidate root causes to individual situations and moments. I'm not going to assign feelings to this woman, but they don't seem to be positive ones.  The idea of the inevitably here is disturbing, and I agree with Carol that many of the comments were heartening that there has been progress.  This is a lot more pervasive. While language is a powerful and important tool, what we call individual situations seems far less important than talking about expectations around sex and that it's just as important to teach about what yes really looks like as it is to discuss what constitutes a no.

On Wed, Sep 17, 2014 at 12:22 PM, Brett Sokolow <> wrote:

And I think that usefully highlights the difference between unwanted and unwelcome.  

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From: Kate Rohdenburg <>
Date: Wednesday, September 17, 2014 at 1:18 PM
To: Carol Mosely <>, "Felty, Wade P." <>
Cc: "" <>, "" <>
Subject: RE: TotalSororityMove article

I would be really careful about “regretted sex” particularly in regards to the situation in the story, which was not regretted, it was unwanted WHILE it was happening. Regretted might be something like “I really want to be having sex with this guy right now, but regret how much it ends up hurting my best friend who is dating him.” It may happen that people regret sex that they’ve had, but that is a REALLY different thing than unwanted sex and confusing the two is often what leads people to the conclusion that people are lying about rape because they decided they “regretted” it after the fact, which we all know is not what happens for survivors of sexual assault.

K

 

Kate Rohdenburg, Program Director

Program Center at 38 Bank Street, Lebanon NH

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From: Carol Mosely []
Sent: Wednesday, September 17, 2014 12:02 PM
To: Felty, Wade P.
Cc: ;
Subject: Re: TotalSororityMove article

 

The comments/discussion following the article are an excellent source for response ideas and they show encouraging signs that the level of understanding of consent is rising. Every person, certainly every survivor, must decide for themselves how they want to define an experience like this. The most important tool for the discussion that educators can offer is to make the concept of consent simple and clear. 

 

I think the term “regretted sex” can be helpful in a discussion of this type of experience. Certainly it’s more helpful than “unwanted consensual sex” which is contradictory and confusing. Juxtaposing regretted sex with sexual assault can deepen the discussion of consent and also help confront the lingering belief that some rapes are really just regretted sex.

 

Carol Mosely

| Director

334-593-0699 office

334-294-4811 cell

www.weendviolence.com

 

 

 

On Sep 17, 2014, at 8:07 AM, Felty, Wade P. wrote:

Colleagues,

 

One of my student peer educators showed this to me and doesn’t know what to make of it or how to respond to the things it talks about. Have you seen this? What would you tell someone?

 

http://totalsororitymove.com/is-it-possible-that-there-is-something-in-between-consensual-sex-and-rape-and-that-it-happens-to-almost-every-girl-out-there/

 

 

Wade

 

Wade Felty

Wade Felty

Office of Residence Life & Housing and Judicial Affairs

Randolph-Macon College

(804)-752-3234 (Office)

(804)-441-4187 (Mobile)

 

 

 

--

Lauren (LB) Klein, MSW

Gender-Based Violence Prevention Advocate & Consultant

MPA/PhD Candidate, Program on Gender-Based Violence; University of Colorado-Denver School of Public Affairs

314.578.8584